Let's talk about Intel MacBook Pro and buying them in 2025

[novagamer]

If you don't mind not having TPM 2.0 for whatever extra security that Microsoft has in mind for Windows 11 like me, you can use Rufus to bypass TPM and other checks and install Windows 11 on old Intel Macs. I've gotten it to install on both:

1) a 2011 Intel MacBook Pro (8,1 with Intel Sandy Bridge and Intel HD 3000 graphics):

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/windows-10-on-macbook-pro-late-2011.2425375/post-34000448

2) as well as a 2020 Intel MacBook Pro (16,2 with Intel Ice Lake, 4 Thunderbolt ports, and the T2 chip):

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/windows-11-on-a-2019-mbp-is-it-possible.2439576/post-33749231

Oh that’s good, will extend the usefulness of the machines for quite a while then.

I read a couple months ago that Microsoft was going back on supporting non-TPM configurations and they’d get killed with an update but if there are workaround that point is moot, definitely.

 

[Aoligei]

Yeah that’s why I said «if possible»

That’s why Intel Mac could be a gap devices for some people, for kids who don’t need lots of computing power, light users should doesn’t want spend a lot.

Eventually people will migrate to AS Mac.

 

[Astuces iOS]

That’s why Intel Mac could be a gap devices for some people, for kids who don’t need lots of computing power, light users should doesn’t want spend a lot.

Eventually people will migrate to AS Mac.

Yeah that’s logic… uh is that the point of the thread? It looks too logic to me lol

 

[Aoligei]

Yeah that’s logic… uh is that the point of the thread? It looks too logic to me lol

I. Apple Silicon Macs are undoubtedly better than Intel MacBook. But that's doesn't mean Intel MacBook are completely useless or worthless.

2. Intel MacBook is more flexible compare to AS Mac due to it uses standard EFI and ability to install other operating system.

3. It could be a cheap budget PC, for people who is looking for budget computer.

4. You should buy Apple Silicon Mac if you can afford. Intel MacBook can be good value for budget shopper who doesn't need lots of computing power. I think Intel Mac are still powerful enough for people who don't need lots of computing power. Like professional won't purchase Intel Mac at this point, they should switch to AS Mac.

In no point, I am saying no one should purchase AS Mac. All I am saying is Intel Mac still offers value and certainly some people will be benefiting from cheap Intel Mac.

 

[Astuces iOS]

I. Apple Silicon Macs are undoubtedly better than Intel MacBook. But that's doesn't mean Intel MacBook are completely useless or worthless.

2. Intel MacBook is more flexible compare to AS Mac due to it uses standard EFI and ability to install other operating system.

3. It could be a cheap budget PC, for people who is looking for budget computer.

4. You should buy Apple Silicon Mac if you can afford. Intel MacBook can be good value for budget shopper who doesn't need lots of computing power. I think Intel Mac are still powerful enough for people who don't need lots of computing power. Like professional won't purchase Intel Mac at this point, they should switch to AS Mac.

In no point, I am saying no one should purchase AS Mac. All I am saying is Intel Mac still offers value and certainly some people will be benefiting from cheap Intel Mac.

If you can find them at very low price yes but where I am they are still expensive (600$ CAD for mba intel 2020) while you can find M1 for a bit more like 750 CAD... or even 700...

Btw consider iPad too.

 

[Aoligei]

If you can find them at very low price yes but where I am they are still expensive (600$ CAD for mba intel 2020) while you can find M1 for a bit more like 750 CAD... or even 700...

Btw consider iPad too.

You won’t buy MBA 2020 Intel, especially i3 or i5 variants. I have 2018 MacBook Air Core i5 and 2020 MacBook Air 2020 i3, both are underpowered machine.

You could find some 2019 MacBook Pro with Core i5 or Core i7 variants, for around $400-$500 local on FB marketplace (and you know, you can bargain quite bit) If you are willing to eBay, some Canadian seller for around $400 or less.

If you willing to OCLP, some i7 2018 MacBook Pro or 2017 MacBook Pro (look for non-touchbar, you can replace SSD) for very cheap.

 

[jktwice]

Okay I've been watching the thread so I'll just ask my question here.

Be me: a poor-ish computing enthusiast who unfortunately caught the Mac bug. I own a fair few old Macs, I don't mind using these old workhorses to do real work. My Power Mac G5 is probably the most fun computer I've used, but now I want to jump into current macOS with no OCLP, no frills, just fire it up and it works and I can install all the cool software people are working on.

I have a budget of $300-$400 for a MacBook of any kind. Hell, convince me enough and I'll extend that to a Mac Mini, but it would be preferable to have a MacBook for the high res, high quality display for photo editing which is mainly why I use macOS. The Intel MacBooks usually come well stocked with a lot of storage and RAM but just run a little slow. The cheap AS MacBooks usually have bottom-of-the-barrel options.

What should I do realistically? I think the answer is to not get a Mac at this moment lmao, but if I really wanted one what would I do? I think with that kind of budget the T2 security chip Intels for a laptop and the M1 or M2 Mac Minis for the desktop would be the play because its more often you find 16GB RAM Mac Minis but that's just my opinion.

 

[throAU]

If you Boot Camp or otherwise replace the macOS with one that will keep security at the forefront, why not. Or keep it offline once the security updates no longer happen. You have about three years of use before that becomes necessary. Back in the early aughts replacing a laptop every three years was de rigeur so a reversion of type…

Microsoft is dropping support for most of the CPUs inside of MacBook Pros, and the rest do not have a hardware TPM compatible with Windows 11 anyway. Windows 10 goes end of security support in October. Can you maybe hack windows 11 onto it? Maybe. For how long? Who knows.

Which leaves Linux; buying a MacBook Pro today to run linux is a pretty expensive way of going about getting Linux on a laptop.

 

[throAU]

I have a budget of $300-$400 for a MacBook of any kind. Hell, convince me enough and I'll extend that to a Mac Mini, but it would be preferable to have a MacBook for the high res, high quality display for photo editing which is mainly why I use macOS. The Intel MacBooks usually come well stocked with a lot of storage and RAM but just run a little slow. The cheap AS MacBooks usually have bottom-of-the-barrel options.

Find an M1 MacBook Air. I think you should be able to find one inside budget. They were only selling for something like $699 new, recently?

A bottom of the barrel MacBook Air M1 will destroy most intel powered machines outside of high end 16" MacBook pros in terms of general performance unless your workload is heavily memory constrained.

If you can find an M2 Mac mini (or Air), that will get you the hardware media engine will significantly outperform an M1 (or anything intel) for video work. M2 and up affectively have the equivalent of a Mac Pro afterburner card built in.

 

[jktwice]

Find an M1 MacBook Air. I think you should be able to find one inside budget. They were only selling for something like $699 new, recently?

A bottom of the barrel MacBook Air M1 will destroy most intel powered machines outside of high end 16" MacBook pros in terms of general performance unless your workload is heavily memory constrained.

If you can find an M2 Mac mini (or Air), that will get you the hardware media engine will significantly outperform an M1 (or anything intel) for video work. M2 and up affectively have the equivalent of a Mac Pro afterburner card built in.

There's no way in hell 8GB of RAM is remotely usable in 2025. I mean I guess I am using a 4GB RAM machine right now to type this comment, but that's on El Cap. You're really saying that in 2025 a machine with 256GB of solid state storage and 8GBs of soldered on RAM can actually run an operating system with a modern kernel, graphical effects, web browser that takes up huge amounts of RAM by itself because of all of the heavy websites, and more?

Photo work can get pretty memory heavy but not like video editing can, and it isn't like I'm throwing on tons of really VRAM heavy filters like liquify or something. I do touch ups and that's it. I like using MacPorts a lot too. I could definitely see 8GBs of RAM working today but in a year or so I am not too sure. That's a scary low amount of RAM for me who has had 16GBs in all of my machines since like 2016.

 

[throAU]

Plenty of videos of people demonstrating that 8GB M1 Mac minis/Airs can edit 4k video - without proxies in Final Cut. Check YouTube for the many examples demonstrating its performance. Basic 4k video work can be done on an iPad.

Yes, it will be limited in the size of the projects, but if you're looking at 6+ year old intel machines, presumably the size and scope of your projects is limited and the budget is small because it is a hobby and not paid work.

I'd suggest bumping the RAM and/or storage up, but it can be done in 8 GB.

People assume they need high end pro/max for dinky little side projects; the higher end machines are aimed at high end video work. The baseline machines Apple make are plenty for smaller hobby stuff.

 

[avz]

I have a budget of $300-$400 for a MacBook of any kind. The Intel MacBooks usually come well stocked with a lot of storage and RAM but just run a little slow. The cheap AS MacBooks usually have bottom-of-the-barrel options.

This is a great summary of the issue that this thread is trying to address.

With a budget of $300-400 you can forget about M-series Macs with 16+GB RAM and 512+GB storage unless you will manage to find a great bargain where the seller is not very knowledgeable and selling a Mac with a minor issue as in a "non-working/as is" condition.

 

[Aoligei]

Plenty of videos of people demonstrating that 8GB M1 Mac minis/Airs can edit 4k video - without proxies in Final Cut. Check YouTube for the many examples demonstrating its performance. Basic 4k video work can be done on an iPad.

Yes, it will be limited in the size of the projects, but if you're looking at 6+ year old intel machines, presumably the size and scope of your projects is limited and the budget is small because it is a hobby and not paid work.

I'd suggest bumping the RAM and/or storage up, but it can be done in 8 GB.

People assume they need high end pro/max for dinky little side projects; the higher end machines are aimed at high end video work. The baseline machines Apple make are plenty for smaller hobby stuff.

Probably. 8GB is just as not future proofing as Intel Mac.

Loading media files, scraping through videos, adding effects to video etc can be done with Intel Mac, especially one with dedicated graphics card. The only thing about Intel, is that it takes longer to render a video than AS Macs. Heck, I even tried to do small video editing project on an N100 mini desktop.

 

[Parowdy]

What Intel Mac is better than a 700 buck M1 Air/Pro?
Intel Macs make sense if you still NEED windows without running a VM, apart from that they are trash.
It hurts me saying that, but it’s true.
We have a 16“ 2019 MBP (32GB, i9, 1TB) with upgraded specs as a windows machine, bought it for ~700€ over a year ago. It’s a good machine, but frankly, if my SO didn’t need Windows compatibility, those 700€ would have been much better invested in a new Mac.
There are still many software issues that will never be addressed on Intel Macs, especially with the Touch Bar.

I don’t say Intel Macs are landfill, but Apple might as well declare them just that.
Sorry, but Intel Macs aren’t anything anymore UNLESS you’re looking for a throwaway machine or a starter Mac for your kids.
I mean, it’s incredible we can buy fairly good Mac’s for ~400€ right now. But once you actually want to use a recent computer and not one from what feels like 10 years ago, they are simply a waste of money.

 

[Parowdy]

You NEED to check what you wrote before posting mate.
„Apple is done with Apple“?
„battery life is certainly better than Apple Silicon MacBook Pro“?

If I didn’t know what you wanted to say I’d be majorly confused.

 

[avz]

What Intel Mac is better than a 700 buck M1 Air/Pro?

A heavily used M1/8/256 with SSD lifetime left around 70-80% is a questionable value proposition in terms of being "futureproof".

 

[Aoligei]

What Intel Mac is better than a 700 buck M1 Air/Pro?

Not a lot. But that is not point for the post. But M1 Air or Pro is 5 years old, battery is likely worn out and SSD life is questionable anyway. And just assume if battery are being replaced, you probably can find battery on an older Intel machine for much cheaper.

For most people who are shopping for used computer, price is most important thing and performance is secondary.

Intel Macs make sense if you still NEED windows without running a VM, apart from that they are trash.
It hurts me saying that, but it’s true.
We have a 16“ 2019 MBP (32GB, i9, 1TB) with upgraded specs as a windows machine, bought it for ~700€ over a year ago. It’s a good machine, but frankly, if my SO didn’t need Windows compatibility, those 700€ would have been much better invested in a new Mac.
There are still many software issues that will never be addressed on Intel Macs, especially with the Touch Bar.

Top spec 16” MacBook Pro performs equal to baseline M1 Mac (not the M1 Pro). If you can found one for lesser price.


And I think spending 700 euro for 2019 M1 MBP as Windows machine isn’t good move either. You could easily find Windows laptop with better spec, aka anything Alder Lake above for this kind of money.

I don’t say Intel Macs are landfill, but Apple might as well declare them just that.
Sorry, but Intel Macs aren’t anything anymore UNLESS you’re looking for a throwaway machine or a starter Mac for your kids.

That’s the point or for people who don’t want spend a ton on a computer.

I mean, it’s incredible we can buy fairly good Mac’s for ~400€ right now. But once you actually want to use a recent computer and not one from what feels like 10 years ago, they are simply a waste of money.

Baseline M1 Mac only offers 8+256. Good luck fining M1 Mac with these budget with 16+500. You can easily find Intel Mac with 16GB RAM and 512GB SSD less than baseline Mac.

And no, recent Intel MacBook does feel like 10 years ago. And cheap Intel is not waste of money. What is waste of money is spending more money for things you don’t need. If all I am doing is light computing task, spending more money on AS Mac is waste of money.

 

[leifp]

Microsoft is dropping support for most of the CPUs inside of MacBook Pros, and the rest do not have a hardware TPM compatible with Windows 11 anyway. Windows 10 goes end of security support in October. Can you maybe hack windows 11 onto it? Maybe. For how long? Who knows.

Which leaves Linux; buying a MacBook Pro today to run linux is a pretty expensive way of going about getting Linux on a laptop.

But buying an old laptop today, at a decent savings, to run macOS for three years and then being able to continue using it safely online with Linux, is not so odd to my mind. People pay more to do less all the time.

 

[Astuces iOS]

You won’t buy MBA 2020 Intel, especially i3 or i5 variants. I have 2018 MacBook Air Core i5 and 2020 MacBook Air 2020 i3, both are underpowered machine.

You could find some 2019 MacBook Pro with Core i5 or Core i7 variants, for around $400-$500 local on FB marketplace (and you know, you can bargain quite bit) If you are willing to eBay, some Canadian seller for around $400 or less.

If you willing to OCLP, some i7 2018 MacBook Pro or 2017 MacBook Pro (look for non-touchbar, you can replace SSD) for very cheap.

Uh MacBook pro 2019 are still expensive… research on Kijiji… I see just around 900$

 

[Aoligei]

Uh MacBook pro 2019 are still expensive… research on Kijiji… I see just around 900$

I just got an 2019 16” Core i7, 16GB, 512GB for $650 Canadian, locally from a used computer store.

Yes. It is M1 MacBook Air price, but I am getting 16”, double RAM, double storage, similar support time frame.

eBay is full of cheap 2019 MacBook Pro.

If you are looking for 13” Core i5, you can find it way under $500.

 

[Astuces iOS]

I just got an 2019 16” Core i7, 16GB, 512GB for $650 Canadian, locally from a used computer store.

Yes. It is M1 MacBook Air price, but I am getting 16”, double RAM, double storage, similar support time frame.

eBay is full of cheap 2019 MacBook Pro.

If you are looking for 13” Core i5, you can find it way under $500.

Yeah sure 16 ram and 512gb storage is cool but if you are a basic user that doesn’t need extreme power like you said then M1 can be a better choice with many advantages !

 

[Aoligei]

Yeah sure 16 ram and 512gb storage is cool but if you are a basic user that doesn’t need extreme power like you said then M1 can be a better choice with many advantages !

Certainly. But it all depends on users. If one wants have bigger screen than 13” or bigger storage, then M1 MBA might not be good fit.

Basic user doesn’t need extreme power, does not necessarily need M1. I don’t think most user will take full advantage of M1 chip at all, Intel MacBook can easily satisfying majority of users.

It is like if all I do on my phone is calling, texting, watching video, taking some videos or taking photos, I don’t necessarily need iPhone 16, I can get buy with iPhone 12.

 

[Astuces iOS]

Certainly. But it all depends on users. If one wants have bigger screen than 13” or bigger storage, then M1 MBA might not be good fit.

Basic user doesn’t need extreme power, does not necessarily need M1. I don’t think most user will take full advantage of M1 chip at all, Intel MacBook can easily satisfying majority of users.

It is like if all I do on my phone is calling, texting, watching video, taking some videos or taking photos, I don’t necessarily need iPhone 16, I can get buy with iPhone 12.

Yeah but don’t forget M1 brings extra features like longer OS support (normally), Apple Intelligence and other features like Spatial Audio with AirPods !

 

[Aoligei]

Yeah but don’t forget M1 brings extra features like longer OS support (normally), Apple Intelligence and other features like Spatial Audio with AirPods !

Yes, if you care about these. I have AS Mac, and I have Apple Intelligence turned off not I care enough to buy Apple Intelligent capable iPhone.

Still rocking iPhone 12 Pro Max and Pixel 7 Pro as my phone.

 

[novagamer]

Okay I've been watching the thread so I'll just ask my question here.

Be me: a poor-ish computing enthusiast who unfortunately caught the Mac bug. I own a fair few old Macs, I don't mind using these old workhorses to do real work. My Power Mac G5 is probably the most fun computer I've used, but now I want to jump into current macOS with no OCLP, no frills, just fire it up and it works and I can install all the cool software people are working on.

I have a budget of $300-$400 for a MacBook of any kind. Hell, convince me enough and I'll extend that to a Mac Mini, but it would be preferable to have a MacBook for the high res, high quality display for photo editing which is mainly why I use macOS. The Intel MacBooks usually come well stocked with a lot of storage and RAM but just run a little slow. The cheap AS MacBooks usually have bottom-of-the-barrel options.

What should I do realistically? I think the answer is to not get a Mac at this moment lmao, but if I really wanted one what would I do? I think with that kind of budget the T2 security chip Intels for a laptop and the M1 or M2 Mac Minis for the desktop would be the play because its more often you find 16GB RAM Mac Minis but that's just my opinion.

Get an M4 Mini base spec and add an external drive for data when you get more money. A lot of people in here justifying their purchases of obsolete machines. Obviously use what you have is the best option budget wise but buying something old unless it is incredibly cheap or you have a specific use case is not wise given the radical shift from x86 to arm.

I spent $5k+ on a nearly maxed out 16" MBP in 2019 (i9, 64gb, 4TB, best video option), so I have some sunk cost bias, and even with that I can admit Apple Silicon absolutely destroys it and it's the greatest "feeling" generational upgrade since the 2000s for me. Everything is much, much faster even in day to day use. It's nearly on the level of going from a spinning disk to an SSD for the first time.

The base M4 has the same single core speed as my M4 Max. You will be extremely happy, and 16GB ram is enough to run all aspects Apple Intelligence when / if it becomes really useful down the road which future proofs the machine, e.g. the local model for Xcode won't install on 8GB already. Apple will probably gate more features in the future at the updated 16GB minimum spec amount of memory and they would not have bumped it unless they felt they had to.

If you really need a laptop hold out a and save up for an M series MBA on sale with 16GB of memory, but I'd still go for the mini unless you can bump the budget up to the M3 or M4 MBA since the graphical horsepower got so much faster.