Are you interested in switching to iPad primary use now with the changes introduced in iPadOS 26?

[Kal Madda]

Been playing with it some today and it’s growing on me. Still would like to find a way to keep the top of Safari from changing from website to website. It did not do that in 18.5 and there has got to be a way to stop it from doing it in 26. I figured out the snap to 4 corner feature, so good there. I’ll give it some more time knowing that it will improve with each new beta.

Edit: It did freeze up a couple times when I was resizing windows.

Awesome! 👍🏻. I’m glad you’re having an overall good experience with it. So far it’s been running pretty well for me as well, with the very occasional little visual glitch. 👍🏻. I think this is a solid update, and I’m surprised that I think everything they announced is already there. That leaves room for even more unannounced updates and improvements to come in future betas and updates! 👍🏻

 

[teh_hunterer]

But Apple has a foothold in the gaming market… the post you responding to is only dedicating to proving that the iPad is mediocre when it comes to “keyboard and mouse” input. Yet, Apple has NEVER marketed the iPad for keyboard and mouse input in terms of gaming.

I never said they marketed it that way. My original post said that gaming on an external monitor with mouse from the iPad was a very rare and subpar experience, hence my continuing to use a Mac. I was responding to someone asking what a Mac does that an iPad doesn't, and that was one of my examples.

It’s always been advertised with controller support… that’s why they go out there way to tell consumers to buy PlayStation and Xbox controllers to use with their iPad.

To be fair they can't really advertise anything else because there are basically no games that have mouse and keyboard anyway. Except Minecraft and perhaps one or two below the radar games.

 

[teh_hunterer]

I don’t know if that’s true or not. Anyone can tell anyone anything, that doesn’t necessarily make it true…

It's plainly true that the vast majority of gamers are playing on something that isn't an iPad connected to an external display.

The reality is that if game devs are using the game porting toolkit to port over console games (and many are, and I believe this trend will only continue and grow into the future), then many such ported games should support all of those things. Developers would actually have to do more work to remove those experiences from the game than they’d have to do including them. Because the game porting toolkit incorporates those things automatically.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but game porting toolkit is not going to automatically overhaul every game's UI so that it seamlessly adapts to touch and mouse/kb and gamepad, it's not going to automatically add scaling and different resolution options. You seem to have a real blind spot for the reality of game development. Game dev is hard. Tools can make it easier but it's still a hell of a lot of work.

But I’m sure changes are coming down the road, and I’m sure that at the very least, new titles ported over will certainly support these things…

But iPads have been able to connect to an external display and have mouse and keyboard support for something like half a decade now, and they don't add those features. Even new games. So how can you be "sure" they're going to do that?

 

[Ludatyk]

I never said they marketed it that way. My original post said that gaming on an external monitor with mouse from the iPad was a very rare and subpar experience, hence my continuing to use a Mac. I was responding to someone asking what a Mac does that an iPad doesn't, and that was one of my examples.

I never said that you did… But your original post was claiming that you could not do gaming on external monitor while recording a session and talking to your Discord, that’s the post which started the dialog between you and @Kal Madda.

But you kept moving the goal post to advance your criticism of the iPad.

It's plainly true that the vast majority of gamers are playing on something that isn't an iPad connected to an external display.

---

Wait a min… @Kal Madda never mention majority of gamers.

 

[Kal Madda]

It's plainly true that the vast majority of gamers are playing on something that isn't an iPad connected to an external display.



Sorry to burst your bubble, but game porting toolkit is not going to automatically overhaul every game's UI so that it seamlessly adapts to touch and mouse/kb and gamepad, it's not going to automatically add scaling and different resolution options. You seem to have a real blind spot for the reality of game development. Game dev is hard. Tools can make it easier but it's still a hell of a lot of work.



But iPads have been able to connect to an external display and have mouse and keyboard support for something like half a decade now, and they don't add those features. Even new games. So how can you be "sure" they're going to do that?

That’s your opinion, and it’s probably true, but we don’t have data here. And as I said, whether or not the majority of people gaming with external displays are using iPads to do so or not is essentially irrelevant.

I understand there is still work involved, but the game porting toolkit absolutely does automatically add the required touch controllers for players to use these games on the iPhone and iPad. That’s just a fact, it is covered in developer documentation. It gives developers simple on-screen controller templates to map controller/keyboard functions of the game to the on-screen controls automatically. So it will make the most sense and require the least amount of work for developers to preserve the controller/keyboard support already present in the game being ported, it would make no sense to remove those things, as that would actually create more work. And unlike most normal apps, game UIs usually already use large buttons that are perfectly fine for touch control in menus and such. Most games wouldn’t require many UI changes at all. And that can be seen with games that have already been ported over, there are generally either very minor UI tweaks, mostly just upscaling, or some minor adjustments, but nothing usually fundamentally different.

You keep bringing this back to keyboard and mouse control support. I don’t know, nor really care all that much if iPad games will support that particular control input for games, and I suspect the majority of people don’t really care much about that either. The majority of people seem to prefer game controllers over keyboard and mouse input for games. So much so that the most popular gaming devices come with controllers packaged, or literally built into the device. My point/claim isn’t about whether or not most iPad and iPhone ports of games will end up supporting keyboard and mouse control (though I do think most games ported with the porting toolkit likely will), my point is mostly about use with external displays. This is absolutely an increasingly popular way to use iPhones and iPads for gaming more like a console, and I’m sure we’ll see improvements in that area… And really, as it is now, it’s still a great experience. I don’t think people are going to merely be won over to not using their iPad or iPhone that can run a game vs lugging around a separate device to play it just because of the external display having some small black bars outside of the game window.

And I absolutely believe that using a Mac for gaming makes a lot of sense for many people. I think the better argument for using a Mac for gaming on an external display is the advantage of a Mac desktop permanently docked with your TV or monitor, so you don’t have to continually disconnect and reconnect your device to the display to game. The Mac is also superior for game emulation, especially higher end models with better specs. The M4 Mac Mini would be nearly perfect as a console/entertainment system hooked up to a TV with the proper software.

So as you can see, I’m not at all saying using an iPad or iPhone for gaming always makes more sense than a Mac. I think a Mac definitely has some advantages in some areas for gaming. But I think gaming on the iPhone and iPad will definitely improve, we’re going to see more console titles porting over, and I’m sure many of these titles will end up also incorporating a bit better external display support. But as I said before, I don’t think it would ultimately matter much, as a little bit of black space on the display doesn’t bother me, and doesn’t seem to bother many of the other people doing it all that much either. 👍🏻

And I will say this, and I think we can agree here, just as there are advantages to the Mac for gaming, there are also advantages for the iPhone and iPad in this sphere. Macs are less portable than these devices in nearly every case, and pretty much everyone carries a phone in their pocket, nobody carries a Mac in their pocket. And there are a ton of mobile games still not available on the Mac. 👍🏻

 

[teh_hunterer]

I never said that you did… But your original post was claiming that you could not do gaming on external monitor while recording a session and talking to your Discord, that’s the post which started the dialog between you and @Kal Madda.

But you kept moving the goal post to advance your criticism of the iPad.

You are, of course, very sensitive to any negative opinion around the iPad, so I can see how you would come to this conclusion. I was merely explaining the vast difference between that particular experience on both platforms.

Wait a min… @Kal Madda never mention majority of gamers.

No no, if you had read the posts you would see we were talking about the overall portion of the gaming market that external display iPad gamers make up, and how that impacts that chance that game developers will actually release games that cater to that portion of the market.

 

[teh_hunterer]

I understand there is still work involved, but the game porting toolkit absolutely does automatically add the required touch controllers for players to use these games on the iPhone and iPad. That’s just a fact, it is covered in developer documentation. It gives developers simple on-screen controller templates to map controller/keyboard functions of the game to the on-screen controls automatically.

That doesn't mean a game that was created without the iPad in mind can just be ported there with the automatic touch controls GPTK apparently puts in. It requires so much work to make a game that wasn't made with touch in mind to actually play well by touch. The touch interface has to be good enough that it can stand completely on its own, for it to be allowed on to the app store, and for it to reach enough sales/downloads for it to be anywhere near worth the effort.

If it was as easy as you say, then half the games industry would be rapidly porting their games to the iPad.

So it will make the most sense and require the least amount of work for developers to preserve the controller/keyboard support already present in the game being ported, it would make no sense to remove those things, as that would actually create more work.

Often they don't, as while keyboard support isn't mentioned, you connect one and it kinda works but doesn't work well. Same with mouse support. It's not as simple as just running GPTK and publishing the game, otherwise you could connect a mouse and keyboard to a game where mouse and keyboard is supported on other platforms, and it would just work. But it just doesn't.

You keep bringing this back to keyboard and mouse control support. I don’t know, nor really care all that much if iPad games will support that particular control input for games, and I suspect the majority of people don’t really care much about that either.

You were the one that was asking me why I didn't consider mouse and keyboard + external monitor gaming that viable on the iPad. I simply said it didn't work well hence my using a computer for it. That's how this conversation started.

my point is mostly about use with external displays. This is absolutely an increasingly popular way to use iPhones and iPads for gaming more like a console, and I’m sure we’ll see improvements in that area… And really, as it is now, it’s still a great experience. I don’t think people are going to merely be won over to not using their iPad or iPhone that can run a game vs lugging around a separate device to play it just because of the external display having some small black bars outside of the game window.

Do you actually do this yourself? I'm curious, because there aren't actually that many good games on iPhone/iPad that play really well in that kind of console + TV setup. I wish there were - KOTOR 2 from the iPad on the TV with an Xbox controller was a pretty decent experience, but it is very rare to find a game that works well in this configuration and is actually a good game in the first place.

 

[Ludatyk]

You are, of course, very sensitive to any negative opinion around the iPad, so I can see how you would come to this conclusion. I was merely explaining the vast difference between that particular experience on both platforms.

Wait a min… I’m not very sensitive about negative opinions around the iPad, all I’m point out is how you claim the iPad can’t do this one thing and then when it’s proven that you can, you’ll find something else lol.

No no, if you had read the posts you would see we were talking about the overall portion of the gaming market that external display iPad gamers make up, and how that impacts that chance that game developers will actually release games that cater to that portion of the market.

But the thing is… you bring up gamers as if only way to play games is on an external monitor hooked up to a mouse and keyboard. And if that don’t exist… that’s not a gaming environment.

In your perspective.. the only way to be a gamer is to hook up a mouse and keyboard, right?

 

[teh_hunterer]

Wait a min… I’m not very sensitive about negative opinions around the iPad, all I’m point out is how you claim the iPad can’t do this one thing and then when it’s proven that you can, you’ll find something else lol.

Please tell me where I claimed the iPad couldn't do something and was proven wrong. I don't think I claimed anything except that some things I enjoy doing are better on other platforms than on the iPad.

I would actually prefer to use an iPad to do these things, if the experience was comparable.

But the thing is… you bring up gamers as if only way to play games is on an external monitor hooked up to a mouse and keyboard. And if that don’t exist… that’s not a gaming environment.

In your perspective.. the only way to be a gamer is to hook up a mouse and keyboard, right?

This thread is not "iPad good or iPad bad?". The thread is "does iPadOS26 make you more likely to switch to the iPad as your primary device?".

I am mentioning the reasons I don't use the iPad as my primary device. I have no idea why you would think I'm a mouse+kb purist. Mouse+kb gaming is simply one of the main reasons why I don't use an iPad as my primary device, because it's something I need my primary device to be able to do.

 

[Ludatyk]

Please tell me where I claimed the iPad couldn't do something and was proven wrong. I don't think I claimed anything except that some things I enjoy doing are better on other platforms than on the iPad.

I would actually prefer to use an iPad to do these things, if the experience was comparable.

The original post… you claimed that the iPad cannot do gaming on external monitor while recording a session and talking on Discord. And then when @Kal Madda said that could be possible… but you later mention that you wanted full display when it comes to using an external monitor.

And criticism is par for course… there’s no such thing as a perfect operating system. We all have our preferences… I use the Mac on a daily basis along with an iPad. I think it’s a greater experience to have both than trying to argue which is better.

I am mentioning the reasons I don't use the iPad as my primary device. I have no idea why you would think I'm a mouse+kb purist. Mouse+kb gaming is simply one of the main reasons why I don't use an iPad as my primary device, because it's something I need my primary device to be able to do.

Well, the dialog between you and @Kal Madda comes off as such.

 

[Kal Madda]

That doesn't mean a game that was created without the iPad in mind can just be ported there with the automatic touch controls GPTK apparently puts in. It requires so much work to make a game that wasn't made with touch in mind to actually play well by touch. The touch interface has to be good enough that it can stand completely on its own, for it to be allowed on to the app store, and for it to reach enough sales/downloads for it to be anywhere near worth the effort.

If it was as easy as you say, then half the games industry would be rapidly porting their games to the iPad.



Often they don't, as while keyboard support isn't mentioned, you connect one and it kinda works but doesn't work well. Same with mouse support. It's not as simple as just running GPTK and publishing the game, otherwise you could connect a mouse and keyboard to a game where mouse and keyboard is supported on other platforms, and it would just work. But it just doesn't.



You were the one that was asking me why I didn't consider mouse and keyboard + external monitor gaming that viable on the iPad. I simply said it didn't work well hence my using a computer for it. That's how this conversation started.



Do you actually do this yourself? I'm curious, because there aren't actually that many good games on iPhone/iPad that play really well in that kind of console + TV setup. I wish there were - KOTOR 2 from the iPad on the TV with an Xbox controller was a pretty decent experience, but it is very rare to find a game that works well in this configuration and is actually a good game in the first place.

I think you overestimate the difficulty of touch controls in games ported with the game porting toolkit. Much of it is handled automatically as I said. There may be some effort beyond the automatic system, but it isn’t that difficult…

Many game industry leaders are porting their AAA titles to the iPad. Now as the Game Porting Toolkit is maturing and growing more advanced, and the iPhone and iPad lineup offers the hardware to support it, more game studios are getting onboard. And as I have said, there is still some effort required to refine the port and such, but it dramatically decreases the effort required to port great games to Apple’s platforms. No other platform provides such tools to make a game port as simple and efficient as what Apple is doing here. And since the game porting toolkit is still relatively new and young, we’re only starting to see the beginning of it’s effects on the Apple ecosystem and gaming.

And likely many of the ported iPad games you’re trying didn’t use the game porting toolkit. As I said, the game porting toolkit is still relatively new and young.

And again, I am not saying you shouldn’t use or prefer a Mac for that. I think different people have different preferences, and I’m perfectly fine with that. I’m just saying I don’t believe the iPad is a poor gaming experience when connected to an external display like a desktop monitor or TV. I can’t speak to the keyboard part as much, because I use a controller rather than a keyboard and mouse, and I believe that’s what most people are interested in anyways. Again, not saying your preferences are wrong, just saying I don’t believe iPhone or iPad connected to an external display is a bad experience.

I actually do connect my iPad and iPhone to external displays for gaming quite often. I even use my iPad as a display for my iPhone sometimes for gaming on the road using a capture card and the Orion app, which essentially turns the iPad into a portable monitor. And I’ve connected both quite often to my desktop monitor for a bigger screen experience, and it’s nice. If there’s a little bit of black space on the screen or not, most of the time I don’t even notice or care…

 

[teh_hunterer]

And criticism is par for course… there’s no such thing as a perfect operating system. We all have our preferences… I use the Mac on a daily basis along with an iPad. I think it’s a greater experience to have both than trying to argue which is better.

That's my stance too. They're both best at different things and I use them both at what they're best at. Especially given that these iPad Pros last so long, it's not too much of a stretch to end up with both. I've had this M1 iPad Pro for 4 years now and it's still perfect for me, no need to upgrade.

Once you have both, you just use them instead of worrying about trying to replace one with the other.

Well, the dialog between you and @Kal Madda comes off as such.

I was just focusing on the reasons I wouldn't be switching to the iPad as a main device. The assumption baked in there is that the iPad is otherwise nearly there and it's these last few things that are still blockers for me.

 

[Ludatyk]

I was just focusing on the reasons I wouldn't be switching to the iPad as a main device. The assumption baked in there is that the iPad is otherwise nearly there and it's these last few things that are still blockers for me.

But it’s a valid question “do these features bring you closer to using the iPad as your primary device?” Not sure why assumption has to be part of it.

And for some folks… even some on Reddit, posted how they are invested into using the iPad over the Mac with what Apple announced for iPadOS 26. I seen one post that they went out and purchase a Magic Keyboard because of the new features.

Clearly, you don’t fall into the group… but there are people that do.

 

[mandopicker101]

In the same way that a laptop can't replace an iPad for you, an iPad can't replace a computer for many. I can't play World of Warcraft on my iPad while talking to my guild on Discord, while I'm recording the session, where the game is on an external monitor and I've got the device's screen showing me information like what gear I'm chasing or other info I need for that raid. Even if WoW could run on my iPad some day, it still wouldn't be able to do all the above.

Or my job, where I need 2 external monitors in order to have everything open that I need to have. Where there are industry specific apps I need to run that simply don't run on iPadOS and never will.

Even if you could do a fraction of the above scenarios with an iPad, and technically suffer through the inconveniences to get some approximation of that stuff done, at the end of the day, why would you? It just wouldn't be worth it. I don't use my 16" MacBook Pro to watch YouTube in bed. I could, but why would I? I use my iPad for that because it's better at that.

For sure - completely agree. It’s using right tool/right job.

Heck, there’s some use cases in my life where even a MacBook doesn’t cut it and I need to borrow a Windows laptop (Phonak’s Roger Upgrader tool).

 

[eltoslightfoot]

For sure - completely agree. It’s using right tool/right job.

Heck, there’s some use cases in my life where even a MacBook doesn’t cut it and I need to borrow a Windows laptop (Phonak’s Roger Upgrader tool).

(90% of AAA PC Games…) I wish I kidded. The situation is bad enough on Mac to even worry about how bad it would be on an iPad. And I am definitely one of those that needs keyboard and mouse for gaming LOL. So it’s Windows Gaming PC/Laptop for the win, unfortunately.

Still, there is nothing saying I can’t do as y’all are saying and use my iPad Pro 12.9” M1 alongside my Windows laptop. In fact, that is what I do.

In fact, I tried to glance on my Surface Pro 11 my wife uses as her secondary machine, and man. An iPad Pro may not excel as a PC/Mac equivalent, but a Surface Pro 11 SUCKS when it tries to be a tablet. Bad.

 

[teh_hunterer]

But it’s a valid question “do these features bring you closer to using the iPad as your primary device?” Not sure why assumption has to be part of it.

Who says it's not a valid question? The assumption is baked into MY post, where I'm listing two reasons why I don't use an iPad Pro as a main device, where I otherwise might if those two blockers weren't there.

And for some folks… even some on Reddit, posted how they are invested into using the iPad over the Mac with what Apple announced for iPadOS 26. I seen one post that they went out and purchase a Magic Keyboard because of the new features.

Clearly, you don’t fall into the group… but there are people that do.

My post was talking pretty much only about my own usage. Other people can do what they like.

 

[pdoherty]

@teh_hunterer @Kal Madda

Would it be possible for Apple to make Mac apps run on an iPad without putting MacOS on it? Me thinks that would be the best solution....IMHO of course. Maybe only active when hooked to an external monitor, keyboard, and trackpad/mouse?View attachment 2522629

I don't see why not - they already made iPadOS apps run natively on MacOS. They're running the exact same CPU architecture, after all.